Yet another garage to convert

[Bob_Savage]

So I'm hoping to convert most of my garage into a recording/practice space, but of course, there are plenty of hurdles.  I'll post my thoughts and needs, and hopefully, somebody can help me address them.

My plan is to erect a wall between the laundry equipment and hot water heater from the rest of the garage, and put an entry door (or double doors?) there.  This will leave an airspace of about 7' between the new wall and the wall between the house and the garage.  Hopefully, this alone will help to keep some sound out of the house.

Next, I plan on removing all of the non-original bracing for the rafters, and framing for a ceiling.  One of my challenges is that I still need storage space in the rafters, and I'm not sure how to accomodate this without causing a significant leak.  I could put insulation and sheetrock on the underside of the roof to also assist in keeping sound out, but my concern with that is, will I need additional framework because of the extra weight there, as well as what will exist from the 8' ceiling?  

Next, I'll have two walls to deal with, one is exterior and the other is partially exterior and partially interior (partly entryway in the house and partly porch/front yard.  These should be fairly simple, I'm guessing, but my big problem is going to be the garage door.  

Fortunately, I bought a thick guage steel door that is also insulated, unfortunately, the wife wanted windows in it.  The other issue is that I cannot put a permanent wall in front of the garage door, due to city restrictions.  I'm still putting myself at risk with the city because the wall seperating the laundry equipment is going to make the distance from the door to the wall about 16'5", which is shorter than my car (doh!)... but I don't think that will be an issue like a permanent wall in front of the garage door would be.

Next is ventilation.  I want the room insulated enough to hopefully help with heating, but I definitely want an A/C unit to be able to blow cool air into the room.  Any input on this is greatly appreciated, as I don't want to to just tie into the existing system for my home.

And finally, at least this is all that's coming to mind, I may need to house some cabinets on one of the studio walls for storage of misc items, and am curious what the best methodology for this is, so as to eliminate vibration/noises within the room.

On the upside, while I don't have a big budget for this, I *do* have more than a couple thousand bucks.  

Any input is greatly appreciated.  Oh, one other thing, what's the general consensus on this Quietrock material (http://www.quietsolution.com/html/quietrock.html )?  

Bob

[johnbergstromslc]

You have a lot of issues to address, but I can comment on one thing: don't use Quietrock.  If there is anything that will utterly bust your budget, that's it!!

[Bob_Savage]

You have a lot of issues to address, but I can comment on one thing: don't use Quietrock.  If there is anything that will utterly bust your budget, that's it!!

Thanks for the tip, John.  

I'm hoping somebody with experience in a situation like I have will hop in with some tips, and perhaps even a realistic cost perspective.  I'd like to find out if the cost is even in my ballpark, before I invest too much time on it.

[johnbergstromslc]

Bob:

You're on the right track to the best solution: a room inside a room.  The physical separation between the walls (especially if you can mount the walls on some MLV or sill sealer) will kill a lot of noise.  Just remember to do some good sealing.  And it's preferable not to use a double door - they don't seal up very well.  

It sounds like you want to leave the space open on the front, so you can open up the garage door and pull stuff in.  That will be a big liability, but not much of the sound will leak into the house.  Just out into the neighborhood.

Also, I'm assuming this will be temporary construction and demolished if you ever decide to sell the house, so why involve the city at all?  If you covered up your garage windows and were discrete about delivery of materials (picking them up yourself with a trailer or U-haul and dropping them off at night) you could do the whole thing without the city's pesky interference.  I've done projects that way and they worked out fine.  Don't feel one bit guilty about it, either....

The cost of your project would depend on the design and price of materials in your area.    

[Bob_Savage]

Bob:

You're on the right track to the best solution: a room inside a room.  The physical separation between the walls (especially if you can mount the walls on some MLV or sill sealer) will kill a lot of noise.  Just remember to do some good sealing.  And it's preferable not to use a double door - they don't seal up very well.  

It sounds like you want to leave the space open on the front, so you can open up the garage door and pull stuff in.  That will be a big liability, but not much of the sound will leak into the house.  Just out into the neighborhood.

Also, I'm assuming this will be temporary construction and demolished if you ever decide to sell the house, so why involve the city at all?  If you covered up your garage windows and were discrete about delivery of materials (picking them up yourself with a trailer or U-haul and dropping them off at night) you could do the whole thing without the city's pesky interference.  I've done projects that way and they worked out fine.  Don't feel one bit guilty about it, either....

The cost of your project would depend on the design and price of materials in your area.    

Hi John,

I'm guessing I would need to hire an architect to see if the structure is strong enough to handle drywal on the underside of the arch, as well as putting in a soundproofed ceiling and reinforcing the two existing walls?  I don't want the garage to tip over in an earthquake.  

Thanks for the info on the double door.

I kind of hate to think of this as a temporary structure, but since the length of the garage is going to be shorter, so that only smaller cars could fit in anyway, I guess it is long term, temporary.  I'm definitely considering putting a wall up on the garage door side, and blocking out the windows in the door so you can't see inside, because keeping the noise from the neighbors is very important because I don't want the police department coming over, and perhaps a savvy one recognizing the room couldn't be to code.  Dumping some thousands of dollars down the toilet would be a real pisser.

Thanks again.

Bob

[johnbergstromslc]

Bob:

Do  you have a digital camera?  Is it possible to take a few pics of the project and post them here?  If you can include details about what you want to do with it, I can give you some basic advice on the materials you need for strength and seismic resistance.  

Even if I can't give you concrete answers, you wouldn't necessarily need an architect for determining strength requirements.  From past experience, they have a good idea of what is needed, but if not, they just consult a structural engineer.  If you drew up a design, you could cut out the middleman have it looked over by a structural engineer and he could tell you beam depths, thickness of the shearwall sheathing, adhesive requirements, screw/nail spacing, etc.  It would be faster and probabaly cost a lot less that way, too.

Besides, an architect would want to hijack and change your project, to inflate his bill.

I wouldn't worry about cops ratting you out to the building department.  They are usually too busy to care, and there is no reward/incentive for that kind of thing.  But yes, it is better not to have them coming around....  If you do end up building the front wall, you could put up curtains or blinds over your garage door windows.

[Bob_Savage]

Bob:

Do  you have a digital camera?  Is it possible to take a few pics of the project and post them here?  If you can include details about what you want to do with it, I can give you some basic advice on the materials you need for strength and seismic resistance.  

Even if I can't give you concrete answers, you wouldn't necessarily need an architect for determining strength requirements.  From past experience, they have a good idea of what is needed, but if not, they just consult a structural engineer.  If you drew up a design, you could cut out the middleman have it looked over by a structural engineer and he could tell you beam depths, thickness of the shearwall sheathing, adhesive requirements, screw/nail spacing, etc.  It would be faster and probabaly cost a lot less that way, too.

Besides, an architect would want to hijack and change your project, to inflate his bill.

I wouldn't worry about cops ratting you out to the building department.  They are usually too busy to care, and there is no reward/incentive for that kind of thing.  But yes, it is better not to have them coming around....  If you do end up building the front wall, you could put up curtains or blinds over your garage door windows.

Hi John,

Yes, I'll try to shoot some pictures this weekend.  The garage is a mess right now because I've got a project going on that has eliminated a room, so the garage is filled, but I'll try to move out some stuff so I can get in there and shoot some pics.

Thanks for the help, and I'll be back with some pics soon!

[Bob_Savage]

John,

Here are some pics.  The garage is a MESS right now, so please don't hold that against me.  

There are four pics.

Front of garage above garage door:

http://members.cox.net/savagemusic/garage_front.jpg

Above rafters:

http://members.cox.net/savagemusic/garage_above_rafters.jpg

Garage back (wall between house/garage):

http://members.cox.net/savagemusic/garage_back.jpg

The big challenge, garage door:

http://members.cox.net/savagemusic/garage_door.jpg

Thanks for the help.

Bob

[ANDY]

Bob, before you shoot down the use of quiet rock you might want to check the prices again, the prices have come down. For the money and ease of installation I think quiet rock would work great in your application. Drop me a email for more info
                                                     Andy

[johnbergstromslc]

Use Quietrock at your own peril.  Just keep in mind, that if you cut a panel incorrectly, it will cost you $99 - not like a $9 panel of 5/8" drywall.

[ANDY]

JUST TO CLEAR THINGS UP, IF QUIET ROCK IS CUT WRONG IT CAN BE FIXED LIKE REGULAR DRYWALL,THE SHEET IS NOT RUINED.JOHN IS OFF ON THE PRICING AS WELL . PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CALL OR EMAIL ME ON PRICING ON ALL THERE DIFFERENT PRODUCTS.

                                                 THANKS
                                                       ANDY


P&A SUPPLIES
1-800-211-4728
ANDYACKERMAN@PASUPPLIES.COM

[johnbergstromslc]

If I'm off on pricing, then put me in my place and POST THEM!  

Let's just cut through the marketing bullsh** and let people decide for themselves if they want to pay that price (and take that kind of risk.)

[ANDY]

THERE IS NO RISK ,IF YO WANT SOMETHING THAT WORKS STAY AWAY FROM RC CHANNEL. THERES MANY OTHER SOLUTIONS

[ANDY]

ALL OF THE SO CALLED (MARKETING BULLSHIT) AS YOU CALL IT, HAS BEEN FIELD TESTED AND LAB TESTED AND ALL THE RESULTS ARE AVAILABLE TO PROVE IT.

[johnbergstromslc]

That's not what I'm talking about.  I've been to the Quietsolution website and I've seen the acoustical tests performed on their products.  I know they work; I am just unwilling to pay their price.

I'm talking about your 'call now for a great deal' type of sales.  

As I said, if you're so confident that you have the magic solution to everybody's problems, then you will have no hesitation to post your prices - for the QR-510, QR-525 and QR-545.  And you should also be honest about shipping costs, too.  That is going to add at least $20 per sheet to the cost.  

Tell you what - Let's say hypothetically, I'm going to replace the drywall in a 10' w X 10' l X 8' h room (walls and ceilings, no windows).  What would my total cost be for QR-525 sheets shipped to zip code 84101?

And don't give me that "call me for a quote" crap.  I can contact Quietsolution directly if I want that run-around.  Tell me (and any other interested party), in a concrete dollar value, what it will cost for my hypothetical project.

Let's see if you have the balls....