Author Topic: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels  (Read 5655 times)

Jason Lewis

  • Guest
Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« on: April 18, 2002, 10:29:02 PM »
I have been researching this forever, and I have been calling all sorts of Drywall, Insulation, Home Repair professionals, dealers, contractors, to see if they can install resilient channels for my bedroom condo ceiling.
The problem is that no one has any idea what I am talking about!!!
I have to explain everything to these people.  Sometimes after I explain what I am talking about, they say "I could do that", but I keep reading that if this isn't installed correctly it won't provide any benefit so I am looking for someone who has done this before.
I even called a home repair radio talk show and they didn't know what I was talking about.
Help!
P.S.  I live in Dallas, Texas if that helps.


Dan

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2002, 02:10:39 PM »
I installed a false floating ceiling using the "super sound clips" (with soundproofing tape + acoustical caulk + two layers of heavy drywall) and it made very little difference (maybe 30%) considering the large expense and inconvenience. Note that the super sound clips are BETTER than the resilient channels that you're considering. If you're trying to eliminate impact noise from above (ie walking, banging, etc.) you're likely to be very disappointed. The best bet is to install carpeting above you. If you're trying to eliminate TV noise, talking etc. then you should just blow some additional insulation into the ceiling.

: I have been researching this forever, and I have been calling all sorts of Drywall, Insulation, Home Repair professionals, dealers, contractors, to see if they can install resilient channels for my bedroom condo ceiling.
: The problem is that no one has any idea what I am talking about!!!
: I have to explain everything to these people.  Sometimes after I explain what I am talking about, they say "I could do that", but I keep reading that if this isn't installed correctly it won't provide any benefit so I am looking for someone who has done this before.
: I even called a home repair radio talk show and they didn't know what I was talking about.
: Help!
: P.S.  I live in Dallas, Texas if that helps.




Jason Lewis

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2002, 05:11:23 AM »
Dan,
Thanks for your reply.  I've noticed that you have replied to a lot of questions on the forum.  I thought I would ask you for additional insight.
Here is my situation.  I'll try to make it brief.
I own a 1st floor condominium.  I was very concerned about noise when buying it, and I made sure to listen for noise when I bought it.  I didn't hear anything, so I assumed that it was fine.  Well, I found out a month later that the reason it was so quiet is that no one was living in it.
From my bedroom, I could hear impact noise as well as her shower, toilet, and washing machine - this is all above my bedroom!!!  Her bathroom and an adjoining room are right above my bedroom.
The person above me doesn't own the condo - she rents it from someone else.
While I was in a bind as what to do - opportunity struck.
The lady above me overflowed her toilet and it came down into my bedroom - totally runing my ceiling and carpet.  I ended up ripping down my ceiling.
I found that there was no insulation at all between the joists.  I didn't know anything about soundproofing so I hired someone who said that they would insulate it and take care of the noise.
They put in some R-19 insulation and some "firerock" drywall which is suppposed to be a little thicker [5/8" vs. 1/2"] and more dense than regular drywall.
I was disappointed that it only reduced the noise maybe 25 - 30%.  Right now, it is "tolerable".  I do go to bed with earplugs and a sound machine.
I wish I knew a little bit about soundproofing before I went ahead and did this because I will need to do it again.
My Condominium Home Owner Association wouldn't pay for the water damage - so I had to take the owner of the upstairs condo and the tenant to small claims court to cover the damages.
I ended up winning my case and the owner paid me about $3,000.
However, the owner now hates my guts [as well as her tenant's], and there is no way that she would ever let me do anything to her unit - such as ripping up the floor boards and putting in floor mats between the floor boards and joists.  That would probably have the biggest impact.
The upstairs tenant has carpet and padding in the adjoinging room.  The bathroom, has no carpeting of course.  The only thing that I might be able to get her to allow me is to put some rubber squares underneath the feet of her washer/dryer in order to cut down on that noise.
There isn't really anything that she is doing that is making so much noise - it is just that noisy.  There is nothing more that I can expect from her.
So I am left with having to do work on my side of things.  I know that this won't be perfect - but even a 40% reduction in noise would be a plus.  I have to do something.
I have been researching this as much as possible.  I have even bought a decibel meter and taken some readings.
Here's what I was thinking of doing:

1.  Rip down ceiling and R-19 insulation.
2.  Put in soundproofing caulk in areas where the floorboards hit the joists.  
3.  Put in some type of soundproofing mat on the underside of the floorboards.
4.  Put in heavier insulation -  possibly R-30, or maybe multiple layers of insulation.  I am going to try and really put in as much as possible.  I believe that in this area the insulation does not have to be ventilated.
5.  Put in bracket for ceiling fan.
6.  Put in another layer of soundproofing material so that it covers the floor joists.
7.  Put in 2 layers of "firerock" drywall, making sure that the drywall doesn't touch the walls [there should be a small gap which will be filled in].  I also will not have the ceiling textured yet.
8.  At this point, I would do some soundchecking - get some measurements from the decibel meter, etc.
9.  I doubt that the job would be acceptable at this point.  I would then install the sound clips with channels and install another layer of "firerock" drywall and have the drywall textured.

I have some questions about doing this such as:
1.  Insualtion - I believe that in this location between the ceiling and floor joists it does not have to be ventilated, but I am not %100 on this.
2.  The ceiling fan - will this work with having it bracketed to the floor joists, and then going through 2 layers of drywall - and then a space and another layer of drywall?
3.  There are multiple PVC pipes above me coming from the shower, toilet, and washing machine.  Is there anything I can do to soundproof those pipes?
4.  How many layers of drywall can you hang from the sound clips/channels?
5.  Owens Corning makes some special "accoustic batts" for insulation.  Is this any better than regular insulation.  I had someone tell me that it is just basic 3 1/2" insulation.

Thank you for your help.
: I installed a false floating ceiling using the "super sound clips" (with soundproofing tape + acoustical caulk + two layers of heavy drywall) and it made very little difference (maybe 30%) considering the large expense and inconvenience. Note that the super sound clips are BETTER than the resilient channels that you're considering. If you're trying to eliminate impact noise from above (ie walking, banging, etc.) you're likely to be very disappointed. The best bet is to install carpeting above you. If you're trying to eliminate TV noise, talking etc. then you should just blow some additional insulation into the ceiling.
:
: : I have been researching this forever, and I have been calling all sorts of Drywall, Insulation, Home Repair professionals, dealers, contractors, to see if they can install resilient channels for my bedroom condo ceiling.
: : The problem is that no one has any idea what I am talking about!!!
: : I have to explain everything to these people.  Sometimes after I explain what I am talking about, they say "I could do that", but I keep reading that if this isn't installed correctly it won't provide any benefit so I am looking for someone who has done this before.
: : I even called a home repair radio talk show and they didn't know what I was talking about.
: : Help!
: : P.S.  I live in Dallas, Texas if that helps.




Dan

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2002, 05:35:31 PM »
I feel your pain Jason. I've gone through a very similar experience, and spent thousands trying to fix it to no avail. What you're suggesting is a significant expense and will likely leave you disappointed. If I were in your shoes I would probably find a new place to live. I know this isn't what you wanted to hear, but I think it's probably the best advice you'll get. Getting a top floor unit would solve most of these noise issues. I would also meet the adjoining neighbors and try some noise experiments to see if the noise levels are adaquate. If they're rude or resistant they're unlikely to make good neigbors.
If you insist on trying to fix the problem, just make sure you have reasonable expectations. I would not expect more than a 20-30% reduction from all the work that you mention.
Addressing the specific questions:
(1) not sure
(2) I would suggest not installing a ceiling fan. It will only make the soundproofing less effective.
(3) not sure
(4) It depends on how they are spaced; whoever you hire will know how to calculate this
(5) I would not buy it
Hope this helps,
Dan

: Dan,
: Thanks for your reply.  I've noticed that you have replied to a lot of questions on the forum.  I thought I would ask you for additional insight.
: Here is my situation.  I'll try to make it brief.
: I own a 1st floor condominium.  I was very concerned about noise when buying it, and I made sure to listen for noise when I bought it.  I didn't hear anything, so I assumed that it was fine.  Well, I found out a month later that the reason it was so quiet is that no one was living in it.
: From my bedroom, I could hear impact noise as well as her shower, toilet, and washing machine - this is all above my bedroom!!!  Her bathroom and an adjoining room are right above my bedroom.
: The person above me doesn't own the condo - she rents it from someone else.
: While I was in a bind as what to do - opportunity struck.
: The lady above me overflowed her toilet and it came down into my bedroom - totally runing my ceiling and carpet.  I ended up ripping down my ceiling.
: I found that there was no insulation at all between the joists.  I didn't know anything about soundproofing so I hired someone who said that they would insulate it and take care of the noise.
: They put in some R-19 insulation and some "firerock" drywall which is suppposed to be a little thicker [5/8" vs. 1/2"] and more dense than regular drywall.
: I was disappointed that it only reduced the noise maybe 25 - 30%.  Right now, it is "tolerable".  I do go to bed with earplugs and a sound machine.
: I wish I knew a little bit about soundproofing before I went ahead and did this because I will need to do it again.
: My Condominium Home Owner Association wouldn't pay for the water damage - so I had to take the owner of the upstairs condo and the tenant to small claims court to cover the damages.
: I ended up winning my case and the owner paid me about $3,000.
: However, the owner now hates my guts [as well as her tenant's], and there is no way that she would ever let me do anything to her unit - such as ripping up the floor boards and putting in floor mats between the floor boards and joists.  That would probably have the biggest impact.
: The upstairs tenant has carpet and padding in the adjoinging room.  The bathroom, has no carpeting of course.  The only thing that I might be able to get her to allow me is to put some rubber squares underneath the feet of her washer/dryer in order to cut down on that noise.
: There isn't really anything that she is doing that is making so much noise - it is just that noisy.  There is nothing more that I can expect from her.
: So I am left with having to do work on my side of things.  I know that this won't be perfect - but even a 40% reduction in noise would be a plus.  I have to do something.
: I have been researching this as much as possible.  I have even bought a decibel meter and taken some readings.
: Here's what I was thinking of doing:
:
: 1.  Rip down ceiling and R-19 insulation.
: 2.  Put in soundproofing caulk in areas where the floorboards hit the joists.  
: 3.  Put in some type of soundproofing mat on the underside of the floorboards.
: 4.  Put in heavier insulation -  possibly R-30, or maybe multiple layers of insulation.  I am going to try and really put in as much as possible.  I believe that in this area the insulation does not have to be ventilated.
: 5.  Put in bracket for ceiling fan.
: 6.  Put in another layer of soundproofing material so that it covers the floor joists.
: 7.  Put in 2 layers of "firerock" drywall, making sure that the drywall doesn't touch the walls [there should be a small gap which will be filled in].  I also will not have the ceiling textured yet.
: 8.  At this point, I would do some soundchecking - get some measurements from the decibel meter, etc.
: 9.  I doubt that the job would be acceptable at this point.  I would then install the sound clips with channels and install another layer of "firerock" drywall and have the drywall textured.
:
: I have some questions about doing this such as:
: 1.  Insualtion - I believe that in this location between the ceiling and floor joists it does not have to be ventilated, but I am not %100 on this.
: 2.  The ceiling fan - will this work with having it bracketed to the floor joists, and then going through 2 layers of drywall - and then a space and another layer of drywall?
: 3.  There are multiple PVC pipes above me coming from the shower, toilet, and washing machine.  Is there anything I can do to soundproof those pipes?
: 4.  How many layers of drywall can you hang from the sound clips/channels?
: 5.  Owens Corning makes some special "accoustic batts" for insulation.  Is this any better than regular insulation.  I had someone tell me that it is just basic 3 1/2" insulation.
:
: Thank you for your help.
: : I installed a false floating ceiling using the "super sound clips" (with soundproofing tape + acoustical caulk + two layers of heavy drywall) and it made very little difference (maybe 30%) considering the large expense and inconvenience. Note that the super sound clips are BETTER than the resilient channels that you're considering. If you're trying to eliminate impact noise from above (ie walking, banging, etc.) you're likely to be very disappointed. The best bet is to install carpeting above you. If you're trying to eliminate TV noise, talking etc. then you should just blow some additional insulation into the ceiling.
: :
: : : I have been researching this forever, and I have been calling all sorts of Drywall, Insulation, Home Repair professionals, dealers, contractors, to see if they can install resilient channels for my bedroom condo ceiling.
: : : The problem is that no one has any idea what I am talking about!!!
: : : I have to explain everything to these people.  Sometimes after I explain what I am talking about, they say "I could do that", but I keep reading that if this isn't installed correctly it won't provide any benefit so I am looking for someone who has done this before.
: : : I even called a home repair radio talk show and they didn't know what I was talking about.
: : : Help!
: : : P.S.  I live in Dallas, Texas if that helps.




boborther

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2002, 07:18:12 PM »
Jason,
We have a customer/contractor out here in Southern California who has just floated a ceiling using the SSP sound clips, and this guy it thoroughly satisfied, He was going to install the mass loaded vinal, but does't think he needs it. I realize that others have used the sound clip technique and had only marginal results, but I have to question their installation if they insist that these clips are not that effective. effective. The guy out here in So Cal, swears it has completely eliminated high heel impact sounds from the people above, and they have hard wood floors.
You can decide for yourself on this one. When you are ready, so are we. Thanks Jason.
Bob O.


boborther

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2002, 07:18:43 PM »
Jason,
We have a customer/contractor out here in Southern California who has just floated a ceiling using the SSP sound clips, and this guy it thoroughly satisfied, He was going to install the mass loaded vinyl, but does't think he needs it. I realize that others have used the sound clip technique and had only marginal results, but I have to question their installation if they insist that these clips are not that effective. effective. The guy out here in So Cal, swears it has completely eliminated high heel impact sounds from the people above, and they have hard wood floors.
You can decide for yourself on this one. When you are ready, so are we. Thanks Jason.
Bob O.


Dan

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2002, 09:13:13 PM »
The amount of improvement probably depends largely on factors that aren't even mentioned on Soundproofing.org such as whether the joists are rigidly connected to the walls, whether exposed pipes are present, etc. Obviously it will work better in some cases, but it's a pretty big gamble considering the expense and inconvenience. Just remember who's guarenteed to benefit from your purchase (soundproofing.org, contracter), and who isn't (you).
: Jason,
:  We have a customer/contractor out here in Southern California who has just floated a ceiling using the SSP sound clips, and this guy it thoroughly satisfied, He was going to install the mass loaded vinal, but does't think he needs it. I realize that others have used the sound clip technique and had only marginal results, but I have to question their installation if they insist that these clips are not that effective. effective. The guy out here in So Cal, swears it has completely eliminated high heel impact sounds from the people above, and they have hard wood floors.
:  You can decide for yourself on this one. When you are ready, so are we. Thanks Jason.
: Bob O.



Jason A-R

  • Guest
Re: Can't find anyone to install resilient channels
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2002, 03:47:20 AM »
Have you looked into hiring a sound engineer?  If they are objective about their evaluation of your situation, then after they work toward correcting the problem, you'll have something to gauge their work against.
I also wonder if the people from whom you purchased the condo disclosed the noise factor.  If not, you may have a case against them.  Likewise, Dan's suggestion that you simply move may put you in a similar situation if you sell.  Disclosing facts that impact a property's value is critical in California.  (Don't know where you are, of course, but similar laws may be on the books in your state.)
Good luck.
Jason A-R
: Dan,
: Thanks for your reply.  I've noticed that you have replied to a lot of questions on the forum.  I thought I would ask you for additional insight.
: Here is my situation.  I'll try to make it brief.
: I own a 1st floor condominium.  I was very concerned about noise when buying it, and I made sure to listen for noise when I bought it.  I didn't hear anything, so I assumed that it was fine.  Well, I found out a month later that the reason it was so quiet is that no one was living in it.
: From my bedroom, I could hear impact noise as well as her shower, toilet, and washing machine - this is all above my bedroom!!!  Her bathroom and an adjoining room are right above my bedroom.
: The person above me doesn't own the condo - she rents it from someone else.
: While I was in a bind as what to do - opportunity struck.
: The lady above me overflowed her toilet and it came down into my bedroom - totally runing my ceiling and carpet.  I ended up ripping down my ceiling.
: I found that there was no insulation at all between the joists.  I didn't know anything about soundproofing so I hired someone who said that they would insulate it and take care of the noise.
: They put in some R-19 insulation and some "firerock" drywall which is suppposed to be a little thicker [5/8" vs. 1/2"] and more dense than regular drywall.
: I was disappointed that it only reduced the noise maybe 25 - 30%.  Right now, it is "tolerable".  I do go to bed with earplugs and a sound machine.
: I wish I knew a little bit about soundproofing before I went ahead and did this because I will need to do it again.
: My Condominium Home Owner Association wouldn't pay for the water damage - so I had to take the owner of the upstairs condo and the tenant to small claims court to cover the damages.
: I ended up winning my case and the owner paid me about $3,000.
: However, the owner now hates my guts [as well as her tenant's], and there is no way that she would ever let me do anything to her unit - such as ripping up the floor boards and putting in floor mats between the floor boards and joists.  That would probably have the biggest impact.
: The upstairs tenant has carpet and padding in the adjoinging room.  The bathroom, has no carpeting of course.  The only thing that I might be able to get her to allow me is to put some rubber squares underneath the feet of her washer/dryer in order to cut down on that noise.
: There isn't really anything that she is doing that is making so much noise - it is just that noisy.  There is nothing more that I can expect from her.
: So I am left with having to do work on my side of things.  I know that this won't be perfect - but even a 40% reduction in noise would be a plus.  I have to do something.
: I have been researching this as much as possible.  I have even bought a decibel meter and taken some readings.
: Here's what I was thinking of doing:
:
: 1.  Rip down ceiling and R-19 insulation.
: 2.  Put in soundproofing caulk in areas where the floorboards hit the joists.  
: 3.  Put in some type of soundproofing mat on the underside of the floorboards.
: 4.  Put in heavier insulation -  possibly R-30, or maybe multiple layers of insulation.  I am going to try and really put in as much as possible.  I believe that in this area the insulation does not have to be ventilated.
: 5.  Put in bracket for ceiling fan.
: 6.  Put in another layer of soundproofing material so that it covers the floor joists.
: 7.  Put in 2 layers of "firerock" drywall, making sure that the drywall doesn't touch the walls [there should be a small gap which will be filled in].  I also will not have the ceiling textured yet.
: 8.  At this point, I would do some soundchecking - get some measurements from the decibel meter, etc.
: 9.  I doubt that the job would be acceptable at this point.  I would then install the sound clips with channels and install another layer of "firerock" drywall and have the drywall textured.
:
: I have some questions about doing this such as:
: 1.  Insualtion - I believe that in this location between the ceiling and floor joists it does not have to be ventilated, but I am not %100 on this.
: 2.  The ceiling fan - will this work with having it bracketed to the floor joists, and then going through 2 layers of drywall - and then a space and another layer of drywall?
: 3.  There are multiple PVC pipes above me coming from the shower, toilet, and washing machine.  Is there anything I can do to soundproof those pipes?
: 4.  How many layers of drywall can you hang from the sound clips/channels?
: 5.  Owens Corning makes some special "accoustic batts" for insulation.  Is this any better than regular insulation.  I had someone tell me that it is just basic 3 1/2" insulation.
:
: Thank you for your help.
: : I installed a false floating ceiling using the "super sound clips" (with soundproofing tape + acoustical caulk + two layers of heavy drywall) and it made very little difference (maybe 30%) considering the large expense and inconvenience. Note that the super sound clips are BETTER than the resilient channels that you're considering. If you're trying to eliminate impact noise from above (ie walking, banging, etc.) you're likely to be very disappointed. The best bet is to install carpeting above you. If you're trying to eliminate TV noise, talking etc. then you should just blow some additional insulation into the ceiling.
: :
: : : I have been researching this forever, and I have been calling all sorts of Drywall, Insulation, Home Repair professionals, dealers, contractors, to see if they can install resilient channels for my bedroom condo ceiling.
: : : The problem is that no one has any idea what I am talking about!!!
: : : I have to explain everything to these people.  Sometimes after I explain what I am talking about, they say "I could do that", but I keep reading that if this isn't installed correctly it won't provide any benefit so I am looking for someone who has done this before.
: : : I even called a home repair radio talk show and they didn't know what I was talking about.
: : : Help!
: : : P.S.  I live in Dallas, Texas if that helps.