Super Soundproofing Community Forum

Soundproofing Forum Topics => Soundproofing Windows and Doors => Topic started by: Potato on March 07, 2018, 02:46:41 PM

Title: Secondary Glazing Alternate Framing? Compression Fit?
Post by: Potato on March 07, 2018, 02:46:41 PM
Hello All,

I've been scouring the internet for DIY double glazing ideas, much like many people here, to help with my noise problem from a nearby road.

I recently moved into a great a new apartment with one drawback, it is very close to a busy road and has A LOT of windows. I've attached a few pictures of the windows frame and height/width/depth on the the inner lip. For perspective, there are 4 windows like this in the living room and 4 in the bedroom. You can see in the image of the frame the old sunroom/front porch and how close the road is.

Since this is an apartment, I'm trying to decide on the least damaging option to the frames (i.e. no screws if possible) and of course the cheapest.

So I'm not sure I like the idea of screwing in frames to mount them. I could just use magnetic strips... but i'm not sure if I should mount them on the plastic window border within the 1 inch depth on the image... or on the far outside of the frames. If I use the outside of the frame it's more of a gap but that leaves me with nowhere to place a magnet on the bottom. I also have some concern on how hard it is to remove that magnetic tape from a wooden frame?

I really like the "compression" fit tubing on the professional pre-built panels. (The one that comes up in Every search, fits intooo the window, don't want to name it specifically in case of any terms issues).  But they are Very expensive. I can't find any DIY instructions on the type of tubing to line the glass with to achieve that same effect though. All the DIY instructions are using the magnets.

I'm hoping for ideas on the tubing to use to achieve the compression fit, or your best ideas on mounting with magnetic strips to these frames?



Title: Re: Secondary Glazing Alternate Framing? Compression Fit?
Post by: Potato on March 07, 2018, 02:50:51 PM
adding width image
Title: Re: Secondary Glazing Alternate Framing? Compression Fit?
Post by: Randy S on March 07, 2018, 05:11:57 PM
Hi Potato,

Ok, a few things I see which validates your concern.
1) the magnetic system needs a steel perimeter to create the seal and using our system would require you to use the L-frame as corner pieces for the 2 sides and top. the bottom frame would need to be inverted allowing the acrylic to rest on the sill and magnetize to the face of to inverted L-frame. (flush mount for max air gap) and you would have to screw in the L-frame.
This is important because you need to achieve the greatest air gap possible to make this cost effective.

The solution for soundproofing windows is "mass / gap / mass"  how you get there can be a number of ways but in the end the airtight seal, air space and mass is the key.

The problem with the other product you mention indow window only uses max 1/4" acrylic which in most cases is not enough mass for a quality reduction based on the cost. The rubber tube around the perimeter is a weak spot in the system.
The other side of the coin is the air gap, 1" is not ideal normally I recommend 2" or greater.

If you want to do this with a compression seal you need a neoprene foam or EDPM seal that is solid and not hollow and figure out how to attach it to the acrylic. This is the problem we ran into when we first designed this system back in 1997..trying to keep cost down the foam seal ended up needing a channel(frame) to keep it in place when compressed in the window. this brought the cost up more then we wanted. Just gluing it was only feasible if you where not removing the insert and like indow would be a weak spot in the system.

I have another method to attach this system but you will need to call me direct.

Randy S.
760-752-3030






 
Title: Re: Secondary Glazing Alternate Framing? Compression Fit?
Post by: Potato on March 07, 2018, 05:46:30 PM
Randy, thank you! I really appreciate the advice.

What material and thickness would you recommend for the panels? I was originally looking at custom cuts of plexiglass acrylic sheets 1/4" myself, but not certain on best material for price/effectiveness.

The more I look into this the more the magnet seal seems to be the way to go. The compression has faults like you said and I'll get a better gap with the magnets.

I'm thinking of maybe using just double sided magnetic tape on the left and top that just tapes to frame, placed in the center of the very outer part of the frame. Then for the bottom sill maybe go with an inverted piece of the L frame there, so only screws there. Would need to make sure that bottom frame is lined up flush for the seal. I'd go with the metal frame all the way around if there was a way I could secure it without screws/nails.

My profile is setup now to receive emails, you can email me directly other ideas if you would like.


Title: Re: Secondary Glazing Alternate Framing? Compression Fit?
Post by: Randy S on March 07, 2018, 05:54:24 PM
I always recommend 3/8" acrylic.

The seal has to be around all 4 sides of the window frame, otherwise you will have a potential leak.

Call me and I will tell you another option.

Randy S.
760-752-3030